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Posted by satori on February 03, 1999 at 18:09:51:

In Reply to: Re: Why pay tax? When , none of the money goes to legal aid? posted by Nick (see My My My, below) on February 03, 1999 at 15:34:59:

I have some theories about how a tenant might be able to get justice in some
landlord and tenant disputes. Most Americans I think 1 in 4 or more have
a home based business. Why can't the tenant sue if they fall under
the law to file claims under RICO.Becuase a company can sue
another company under RICO. Most of the stuff I seen in
RICO caess was that involoving landlord disputes with other
realty agencies ectera and from what I have been reading
in the Voice and hearing at the last DHCR hearings I went to
fear is at the root of all overcharges in Rent stabilized housing
in NYC. I also bet that the tenant pays more in legal fees
then the typical landlord here in NYC, The landlord
probably has one law form handle all the evictions
at a set fee regardless of the amont of tenants they
drag into court.I don't know if anyone
ever researched that question. When, I was at the
last DHCR hearings one landlord was crying about how expensive his
legal fees were. I think , they should be forced to make
it a public record things like that( there legal expenses) so people
can have some idea, what sort of housing
situation they are getting into.

: : Why should anyone pay tax, when the government does not pay for programs
: : to help the "social condition"? like (legal aid) It seems to me that they get
: : at least 50% percent of the estate of everyone that dies in this country
: : by will or other means one way or another. And they provide nothing as far as social
: : services, as far as providing legal aid that is needed by tenants that
: : are bothered by landlords.I find the whole thing a sham. A landlord charges
: : most of the money a person would have for rent, then when he questions
: : it he has to have millons of dollars to sue the city the state, and the
: : landlord what a sham.

: First, only the top one-half of the top one percent of all estates are subject to the federal estate tax. The bottom 99.5% are not, courtesy of the unified credit ($650,000 now, I believe). But you do get some substantial benefits from the tax system: public transportation, medical research, etc. Second, your quite apt observation about how our legal system tilts to favor entrenched wealth applies to far more than landlord/tenant disputes. Just ask any public defender who's tried to defend someone facing the death penalty. Well-off interests have always used the legal system to further their aims over the less well-off. Perversely, the tax system actually subsidizes landlord litigation against tenants. Landlords generally can deduct these legal fees as ordinary and necessary business expenses under Internal Revenue Code section 162. Residential tenants cannot. For them, legal fees are non-deductible capital expenditures. And if you're defending a lease, you'll never get any tax benefit from them (unlike a house, where at least the owner can increase his basis in the house and recover these costs when he sells the house). Poor people get trodden upon by the legal system every day (just talk to any public defender who's defended someone facing the death penalty). Perhaps a narrow solution would be to equalize the tax treatment of legal fees: make them entirely non-deductible. While not eliminating landlord abuse of the legal system, it would make it more expensive for them to litigate (by their marginal tax rate).

Follow Ups:

• You obviously have no idea what RICO is and how it works MikeW 2/04/99 (3)
  • Re: ( A RICO ARTICLE) You obviously have no idea what RICO is and how it works satori 2/05/99 (0)
  • Re: You obviously have no idea what RICO is and how it works satori 2/05/99 (1)
    • Re: You obviously have no idea what RICO is and how it works MikeW 2/05/99 (0)

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Comments:
: I have some theories about how  a tenant might be able to get justice in some 
: landlord and tenant disputes. Most Americans I think 1 in 4 or more have 
: a home based business. Why can't the tenant sue if they fall under
: the law to file claims under RICO.Becuase a company can sue 
: another company under RICO. Most of the stuff I seen in 
: RICO caess was that involoving landlord disputes with other 
: realty agencies ectera and from what I have been reading 
: in the Voice and hearing at the last DHCR hearings I went to 
: fear is at the root of all overcharges in Rent stabilized housing
: in NYC. I also bet that the tenant pays more in legal fees 
: then the typical landlord here in NYC, The landlord
: probably has one law form handle all the evictions
: at a set fee regardless of the amont of tenants they 
: drag into court.I don't know if anyone  
: ever researched that question. When, I was at the 
: last DHCR hearings one landlord was crying about how expensive his 
: legal fees were. I think , they should be forced to make 
: it a public record things like that( there legal expenses) so people
: can have some idea, what sort of housing 
: situation they are getting into.

: 
: : : Why should anyone pay tax, when the government does not pay for programs 
: : :  to help the "social condition"?  like  (legal aid) It seems to me that they get
: : :  at least 50% percent of the estate of everyone that dies in this country
: : : by  will or other means one way or another. And they provide nothing as far as social
: : :  services, as far as providing legal aid that is needed by tenants that 
: : :  are bothered by landlords.I find the whole thing a sham. A landlord charges 
: : :  most of the money a person would have for rent, then when he questions 
: : :  it he has to have millons of dollars to sue the city the state, and the 
: : :  landlord what a sham.

: : First, only the top one-half of the top one percent of all estates are subject to the federal estate tax.  The bottom 99.5% are not, courtesy of the unified credit ($650,000 now, I believe).  But you do get some substantial benefits from the tax system:  public transportation, medical research, etc.  Second, your quite apt observation about how our legal system tilts to favor entrenched wealth applies to far more than landlord/tenant disputes.  Just ask any public defender who's tried to defend someone facing the death penalty.  Well-off interests have always used the legal system to further their aims over the less well-off.  Perversely, the tax system actually subsidizes landlord litigation against tenants.  Landlords generally can deduct these legal fees as ordinary and necessary business expenses under Internal Revenue Code section 162.  Residential tenants cannot.  For them, legal fees are non-deductible capital expenditures.  And if you're defending a lease, you'll never get any tax benefit from them (unlike a house, where at least the owner can increase his basis in the house and recover these costs when he sells the house).  Poor people get trodden upon by the legal system every day (just talk to any public defender who's defended someone facing the death penalty).  Perhaps a narrow solution would be to equalize the tax treatment of legal fees:  make them entirely non-deductible.  While not eliminating landlord abuse of the legal system, it would make it more expensive for them to litigate (by their marginal tax rate).


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