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adjusted lease period start

NYC Rent Regulation: Rent Control/Rent Stabilized, DHCR Practice/Procedures

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adjusted lease period start

Postby mandown » Thu Feb 01, 2018 5:19 pm

They sent my stabilized lease renewal maybe 70 days before the start date. This was adjusted a long time ago when they screwed up the renewal, lot of back & forth, finally set a new month, around middle of month.

Now another LL-Tenant org tells me the start date has to be the RENT PERIOD following 90 days from receipt. So, the 1st of the month, 2 months farther away.

LL is telling me "we don't have to change jack"! Also that the renewal delivery time is "ballpark" and also that they sent one out 120 days prior & this 60-day one was a courtesy. I checked my mail starting back in September -- they sent nothing. "That's on the USPS" they say.

Who's right? I don't want to start a fight(/retaliation) over something small but I'd like a proper lease renewal & if my source is right they haven't done one right... *ever*.

Their cover letter is dated about a month after the lease renewal and says nothing about a 2nd attempt.
Deadline to sign (according to usual thing of delivery + 60) is right about... now.
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Re: adjusted lease period start

Postby TenantNet » Thu Feb 01, 2018 6:01 pm

If this is a continuation of another thread, please post to that. It seems to be an ongoing conversation.

Lease renewal rules are set out in the instructions for the lease renewal form rtp-8
(http://www.nyshcr.org/Forms/Rent/rtp8.pdf). See page two of this document.

It plainly says that lease renewals must be mailed/delivered to the tenant between 90 and 150 days prior to the end of the current lease term. If a LL is smart they will also send it cert mail RRR.

If it was only 70 days (as indicated by the postmark on the envelope that you should have kept), then it's late. If it's not a big deal, you can complete it and send it back (and you MUST do that by certified mail RRR).

Or you can insist on the remedy laid out in the instructions.

If the owner offers a Renewal Lease less than 90 days prior to the expiration of the existing lease, the lease term selected by the tenant shall begin at the tenant's option either (1) on the date a renewal lease would have begun had a timely offer been made or (2) on the first rent payment date occurring no less than 90 days after the date that the owner does offer the lease to the tenant. The guidelines rate applicable for such lease shall be no greater than the rate in effect on the commencement date of the lease for which a timely offer should have been made, and the increased rental shall not begin before the first rent payment date occurring no less than 90 days after such offer is made.


Renewal dates should be on the first of the month, not somewhere in the middle of the month.

We do not suggest you unilaterally change the dates. I would send it back to the LL (cert. mail RRR), explain the issue, show him what the RTP-8 form says and ask him to change it. If he doesn't then I would a) complete the renewal "UNDER PROTEST" and file a challenge with DHCR.
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Re: adjusted lease period start

Postby mandown » Thu Feb 01, 2018 8:02 pm

Thanks.
No, I never brought this up before, I don't think. Other threads are about other stuff.
Never tried to change start date myself, always left it to them.

But I did challenge them on the 1st renewal (full of errors), and even finally told them what needed fixing... nice of me. Someone who works in the rent office brought this up last week, like they still hold a grudge a decade later that I was right about the job they're paid to know how to do.
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Re: adjusted lease period start

Postby mandown » Wed Feb 14, 2018 12:34 pm

They refused. There's an office, we met. (He also said he had proof he sent it out 120 days in advance or whatever, but didn't show me any.)
I can probably hand it over in person but I'll send it certified... to that office, I guess.
Are you saying I have to write "UNDER PROTEST" on the renewals themselves?
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Re: adjusted lease period start

Postby TenantNet » Wed Feb 14, 2018 2:43 pm

So ask for the proof. Follow the instructions on the back of the RTP-8. You can always file a complaint with DHCR for the owner not offering you a lease ... or a lease at the proper rent and time periods.

You don't lose your RS status, and your rent can't go up while you don't have a lease.

I haven't had a lease in about 4 years. What you can do is send a letter cert RRR telling your LL that it is your "intention" to renew your lease at the legal regulated rent, but that they are not offering it to you properly. Tell him if they send you a proper renewal, you will sign and renew it.

You can sign it under protest, but that makes sense only if you also file with DHCR. Or you can insist on a proper renewal - or insist on the LL showing you proof of the mailing date.
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Re: adjusted lease period start

Postby mandown » Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:17 pm

OK... HCC just said they'd like to send a letter covering this before I sign anything.
Does it matter when LL sent it, if tenant didn't get it?
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Re: adjusted lease period start

Postby TenantNet » Wed Feb 14, 2018 8:04 pm

I think it would matter. If LL can prove it was sent, then I would think the original time periods would prevail. Of course this is only true if you go to court, or to DHCR.

Right now you're jockying for position. If HCC wants to send a letter to the LL, that's probably a good thing to do (although I have heard multiple complaints about HCC - depending on who you are dealing with over there ... so just make sure it covers everything).

The purpose of any such letter is to be self-serving if/when you go to court. It would paint the LL in a corner, asking him to prove when he sent the lease. It should also be explicit in telling the LL that it is your "intent" to renew the lease. Case law often refers to the tenant's intent.

Also ... all this in an exercise at bluffing, so you can a) stand for your rights, and b) avoid litigation. It's important to stay out of court if possible.
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Re: adjusted lease period start

Postby mandown » Mon Feb 19, 2018 2:12 pm

You’ve each said 2 things about this that seem to be going in slightly opposite directions.
HCC: tenant can have a stabilized lease date start mid-month; renewal stuff is based on when tenant receives it, not when they send it.
TN: no leases mid-month & it does matter when they say they sent it.

I had no intention of ending up in court—why would there be court? Doesn’t the issue get decided by DHCR? Unless you mean eviction, which I don’t think they plan to try. (At least they said otherwise.)
So your last suggestion felt pretty safe (DHCR adjusts it after signing), but now they’re telling me: send a letter first.

I read the thread above this; is non-compliance the dangerous thing I have to file now? Occurs to me I don't know what the specific actions are.
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